The basic
idea is that the rich are, well, rich. I recall the comic book character Stooge
McDuck. He was very rich and he loved to enjoy many moments in his vault
playing with his money. That image of the rich apparently has stuck with a lot
of people these days and it makes it a lot easier to want to remove some of
those coins from Scrooge's vault.
But I kid of
course. One too many JDs this morning and all that.
But the truth
is that the nation or at least some of us seem very interested in helping the
rich part with their income and assets. The main idea seems to be that the rich
won’t miss their money very much and there is a ton of good we can do with the
resources. We can write off student loans, help the poor, save the planet, and
much more.
So I wanted
to think about all this a little more today. The first point an economist might
make is to bring up the idea of the diminishing marginal utility of income. Let’s call this DMU since it is a huge mouthful to keep saying that over
and over. DMU is a real thing and most freshmen at most universities are
harangued about DMU by their wonderfully charming and entertaining graduate teaching
assistants. It is a simple idea. If you are poor and I give you $10,000 dollars, you will be happier. If I give you $10k more on top of that, you will be
happier but the increase in your happiness is not as big as the first tranche.
By the time I have given you $1 million, the next $10k is hardly noticeable –
the extra satisfaction you derive is negligible.
So it is
true that by taking more taxes from the very rich, they might not notice it a
lot. DMU explains why.
You cannot
say that I didn’t start out on the left foot. But from here it gets more sketchy.
What happens
when you take money from the rich?
The rich
definitely give a lot of money to charity. What if the rich decide that they only want to
spend a given amount for charitable private and national purposes and reduce their charitable
giving by the extra amount of the taxes? Think of the United Way or your local Boys
& Girls Club. What if we get free student loans but we have to reduce the
activities of local charities?
What else does
Scrooge do with all his coins? For one
thing, we know that the rich don’t really bathe in vaults of money. They stay
rich because they invest their money wisely – or at least try to do so. They often earn handsome rewards, but do the rest of us benefit from their
investments?
I would
think we do.
These
investments can be directly spent on bricks and mortar – maybe a factory in your
town.
These
investments can show up in saving accounts in banks – and that money is loaned when you buy a car or a company borrows money to modernize operations, do research into new technology, or buy new equipment.
That money
goes into bond markets meaning that companies and governments have a pool of
funds for their needs, and this puts pressure on interest rates to stay low.
Much of the rich’s money goes into stock markets. Our pensions and other assets enjoy appreciation and growth when there is a strong demand for stocks.
There is the incentive issue too. We enjoy the fruits of entrepreneurship in small and large companies. We love it when companies solve problems, and we get better products and services. We love it when competitive companies innovate and reduce the prices we pay for all sorts of goods and services. Much of those activities come because capitalists love to improve things -- but it also comes because they love making money that they can use for all sorts of things. Paying taxes reduces how much they get to keep. Is there a point at which tax rates get so high that they would rather avoid all the pain of invention and sit all day at Peet's? Or go across the street and have a JD at TG?
You get the
main point here. Whether it is local charities or various other uses of the money held by the rich, there are very widespread and measurable benefits to society.
I know the rich also use their money to buy yachts and caviar and spoil their rotten children. But another yacht creates employment and even a weekend in Vegas provides jobs for dealers, Uber drivers, and cleaning personnel. I don't believe for a minute that the rich do not enjoy incredible lifestyles -- but that is not the whole story.
What’s left
to say has to do with the idea that our government can use the money in even
better ways than the rich. Sure we might have a little less of this or that when the rich change their priorities – but just
imagine all the good that will come if incomes are more equal, we write off
student loans, we give people better education, and so on.
Here is
where we should all be from Missouri the
Show Me State. We all learned about snake oil salesmen. We are taught that snake oil can sound really
enticing. Is it not possible that those who speak the loudest about taxing the
rich are people who will themselves gain power and riches in doing so? Why do
we trust them so much when they have so much to gain?
Worse than
that is just the reality of government in the face of immense and ongoing
challenges. Do we really trust those clowns to do better than the last batch of
clowns? Why now, with a little more money, will we solve problems of education, poverty, and environment? Will a little more money suddenly solve what decades of money has not been able to eliminate much less reduce?
Do you really believe that adding even more money into poverty programs
is going to miraculously successfully reduce inequality of income? Have we really figured out how to use public
money to reduce the incidence of poverty when decades of poverty programs
have done nothing but increase the rolls of poverty? Is it really fair to write
off the loans of mostly people taking graduate work at private institutions
when we didn’t do that for past generations of students? Will we be willing and able to
provide such education for free for all future ones?
I’m not rich
and I don’t care if we tax the rich. But if we do, I’d like to make sure that
the net result is positive. The rich will reorient how they use their money.
Are we sure those changes won’t make people worse off? Clearly the uses of the
new monies could have wonderful results. But are these snake oil salespeople bent on convincing us that they have learned something new that will really reduce our
nation’s problems? I haven't heard it yet. You? Show me how and why it will work this time.
Dear LSD. Me thinks maybe yer tiring of economics and leaning toward philosophy . . . . the only question you didn’t ask is, “How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?”
ReplyDeleteYour basic question, rephrased is, “Is there a greater good to be achieved by the govomit taking wealth from the wealthy to purportedly solve some undefined and proven perennial problems?” Me thinks not. You referred to the vast amount of taxpayer money already expended to solve those problems—demonstrably unsuccessful. Translation: The govomit cannot solve those problems by throwing more moola at them. (Aktually, it’s incapable of solving many problems . . . . ) What you didn’t mention wuz that the totality of the wealthy’s wealth pales in comparison to the amount of money being bandied about to solve those problems. Take all their wealth, spend it on solving those problems, and you’d still have them. Albert allegedly said it best, “Trying the same thing over and over and expecting a different outcome is insanity.” Also not mentioned is the Constitutional issues associated with a wealth tax—the C mentions only taxing income—not wealth.
Boiling this down to the barest and lowest common abominable denominator is the Ds perennial fav of tax and spend to garner votes and gain power. The wealth tax—like the D’s prospects of winning the WH in ’20—is DOA. Nevertheless, they’ll keep pounding their insane tax and spendthrift drum all the way to ’20 defeat.
BTW, me thinks that with sufficient JD you could discern the number of angels dancing on that pin.
Thanks Tuna. JD definitely is a wonder drug. When I do calculate the number of said angels I will share it on the blog. Until then -- I will stay on my JD diet. While you accuse me of leaning philosophically you also seem to agree with everything I said -- though Tunas are sometimes more conservative and mean than me. :-) Keep up the good work.
DeleteDear LSD. Yeth, I don’t disagree with wut you sed. But you didn’t say the wealth tax wuz both implausible and impractical but me thinks that wuz wut you meant . . . read’n betwixt the lines. So, allow me to say it fer ye. Now that you don’t have to say it you can fondle that boddle of JD and count de angels.
DeleteI like the way you read between the lines. Sometimes I like to lead the horse to water....
DeleteEd H was not able to post his comment so I am doing it for him. See below.
ReplyDeletePublish button does not seem to be working. Here is my comment:
Can't really disagree with how you frame the argument. It seems to me that any redistribution has to start before profit distribution, not after the fact as a tax on investor decisions. My argument has been that we need to return to a time where the profit generators ( businesses) elect to distribute the results of their annual management skills such that there is a better reckoning of the relative contributions of employee, including the officer corps, customers and shareholders. We address all three stakeholders through reinvestment, and that is a proper business decision. We need to carve out a share that is fairer to the whole spectrum of producers from the broom sweepers to the CEO--just another form of reinvestment. The balance, and therefore the third decision, not the first, would be to distribute the remainder to shareholders along any and all of the lines chosen today. At this point, we will need to hold people responsible for how they spend their money and not look to a failing national bureaucracy to fill the gaps through redistribution methods that have high overhead and a tendency to reward the squeaky wheel. The noted Work place Psychologist, Fred Herzberg conducted extensive studies in the 60's and 70's demonstrating that regardless of pay scale or organizational level, the "next monetary raise" was always a short term motivator--akin to your DMU concept. However, money that goes to self-control of one's situation has an ownership and responsibility component that does not accrue to gifts or distributions that are appreciated but not earned.
Thanks Ed. That an interesting perspective. The idea that we "carve out a share that is fairer to the whole spectrum of producers" seems to be the challenging part of your argument. Not sure how you do that.
DeleteCan't tax wealthy so why try... except...
ReplyDeletehttps://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2019/2/27/18243183/bill-gates-foundation-reddit-ama-billionaire-taxes
Let's just fire Congress and let Bill Gates run the country. I doubt he really represents rich people in general. He gets to have his opinion about taxes like everyone else. And by the way, if he wants to pay more in taxes there is nothing preventing him.
DeleteWe've taxed the wealthy more and less in history. Is there evidence that the US has hit some optimal level and therefore "more tax" is less optimal?
ReplyDeleteHaving wealth that can be invested IS important, but our wealth is hyper concentrated today compared to the last 100 years so unless we have evidence that this is an optimal state I think it's very sound to consider taxing the wealthy more - as we have in the past (when the middle class was bigger btw).
Thanks Don F. Neither history nor simple economics will solve this debate. I just hope you will be happy to assume responsibility for all the fallout when you get your wish to tax the rich more.
DeleteMost “poor” Americans have things that middle-class Americans of an earlier time could only dream about, including flat screen TVs, smart phones, microwave ovens, and cars.
ReplyDeleteLeftist redistribution of income could never accomplish that, because there are simply not enough rich people for their wealth to have such a dramatic effect on the living standards of the poor, even if it was all confiscated or taxed and redistributed. Many attempts at redistributing wealth in various countries around the world have only ended up redistributing poverty.
The rich can see the political handwriting on the wall, and often take their money and leave the country, long before a government program can get started to confiscate it. They are also likely to take with them skills and entrepreneurial experience that are even harder to replace than the money.
Despite a voluminous and often fervent literature on "income distribution and income inequality," the fact is that most income is not distributed: It is earned.
The distribution of complex variables, such as obesity levels, fertility rates, IQs, wealth, and annual incomes are never equal, and some are highly skewed. Fertility tends to be greatest where people are poorest. Redistributing poor babies into rich households won't solve poverty any better than Robin Hood's noble efforts.
Doober: You confuse me. Sometimes you are Doober the liberal, and sometimes you are Doober the libertarian. Today you fall into the latter category. First, there is absolutely no evidence that the moneyed class used their massive tax cut to invest in anything except increased dividends to their share holders. Second, do you propose that infrastructure get fixed with private funds? If you think toll roads are expensive now, wait until they are privatized. I do agree that simply throwing $s at our problems is not a solution. But throwing $s WISELY is infinitely better that doing nothing at all. Adam's invisible hand does not fix all. Thank you for getting be involved. Signed: Dr. Mic (as Hal used to call me).
ReplyDeleteThanks Dr.Mic. I guess libertarian fits me about as good as anything. I don't recall being a liberal. Basically I try to be moderate -- try to show that the problems and solutions are much more complicated than the extremes admit. With respect to how the rich spend their money -- I was being theoretical in the sense that the rich do use their money in ways that impact and usually benefit society. I was reminding people of some of those ways as the left-wing pols revel in attacking the incomes and wealth of the rich. It ain't no free lunch. If you take the rich's money then there will be impacts. And then you agree with me that government is not without warts either.
DeleteAs I said, show me the money. Show me how snagging all that extra money is going to make a real dent into our national problems. I have never and will never say the invisible hand fixes all. The so-called free market is tainted but so is government. That's the rub and what makes all this interesting. Voters and tax payers should not be trusting of business or government.
I think Economics 101 can easily solve the question. Taxing wealth creates incentives not to invest, wealth is very difficult to measure and is probably impossible in a day when wealth can be so easily transferred around the world. Case closed.
ReplyDeleteThanks Mr Yachts. Taxing wealth is sort of like taxing purient thoughts.
Delete